Here is the 14th in a series of Divorce Corp polls. Please vote only once. Many have asked if we would track the voting from men and women separately, so we are giving that a try. We will post the results after we have received a statistically significant number of votes.
[polldaddy poll=7834434]
Women’s percentages are accurate to within + or – 4% and the men’s percentages are accurate to within + or – 2%:
The results here are somewhat surprising, but reassuring. There is a vocal contingent of anti-domestic-violence activists who claim that requiring a jury to take away a parent’s custody rights would place too high of a burden of proof in cases where there are allegations of domestic violence or abuse. In real cases of domestic violence or abuse, this is a concern. Nevertheless, allowing a single judge, often on a knee-jerk response, to take away someone’s rights to raise their children is an unsatisfactory solution. It’s analogous to adding a speed bump to highway, only worse – it’s like erecting a wall on the highway. Yes, it may serve the needs of a segment of society, but it completely strips away the rights of a much larger segment of society, and it denies children access to a fit, capable parent in the vast majority of cases. Given that only 11% of women and 5% of men believe that a single judge should make these life-altering decisions, we believe it is time to change the laws to require a jury trial (subject to a short-term restraining order pending a speedy trial in criminal court). If you wish to get involved in our reform efforts, please sign up at divorcecorp.com/reform. Thank you.
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This would maintain some type of order and keep the judge from unilaterally making bad choices. This would make the lawyer responsible for the outcome.
Folks,
Really simple here, your in for divorce with your ex. Its you and her / him. if there is no facts or documents provided to the courts the the kids should be 50/50 right out of the gate. If your were both good parents when your married then why not when your divorced… Why because money, these kids become paychecks, so without really thinking on whats going on your calling or ex.. all types of things to gain the kids for money. Money people really over kids, these kids grow fast, and clearly what is done today in court or next year in court the kids do understand and see it from themselves. Things come out clear as day over time in court and do not not stop fighting until you get it right for the kids and not the pocket! AND FOR THE PERSON THAT MAKES THE MOST SUCK IT UP GET A 50/50 PHYSICAL WITH YOUR KIDS PAY THE LION SHARE OF THE KIDS EXPENSES AND ACTIVITIES AND NOT TO SUPPORT. DAD or MOM needs to go to work now and help, by the time they grow up both parents should be able to support themselves. I dont care who slept with who or how it happened, make it right for your kids and cut the shit!
I agree with you in theory, but the fact is that LOTS of people realize “too late” that they had a child with a crazy person (whether male or female). In fact, it’s often because of the craziness that the couple splits. People who have not dealt with narcissists or lived with someone w/ borderline personality disorder or married a psychopath will never understand this. Normal people do not understand mental illness until it is in their face. And when it is, it is scary!
Evelyn, you are so right! Your clearly speak from experience. Good luck to you.
I concur with Evelyn: Mental illness intensifies with age. What were once red flags in the earlier years have now become huge problems and a danger to you and your kids. I don’t know the best answer, but judges need special training in personality disorders, which incidentally, are more and more prevalent in today’s society. It is very easy for an extremely charismatic narcissist to convince judge, jury and attorney that they are the more fit parent (and many times the narcissist IS a judge or an attorney). Also, sexual abuse is quite normal amongst narcissists. The child is an extension of the narcissist and since they love themselves they sexually abuse that “special” child, especially if there is more than one. This is a simplified explanation … nevertheless, ugly, ugly stuff.
Who is “Family Court Review” ? The writer sounds like a child predator, or a super predator, preying off conflict and anger of divorcing parents, a real hater.
divorce court defined: “A place where parents pour their time and money into a process of physically, psychologically, and financially harming themselves, their spouses, and their children, while “family lawyers” and their henchmen earn windfalls fleecing parents, harming and separating children as a function of the strength of the parent-child bond (generating fees as a function of the intensity and duration of parental conflict), all with the active complicity of the family court.”
Evelyn…you are very insightful and very correct. Though never married, I am in court going through custody/visitation/child support court proceedings with my ex who has strong narcissistic and antisocial tendencies (which is the very reason we are no longer together) and, because I am not in a professional capacity in these proceedings, I am not able to bring this to light other than with evidence. It is very concerning that judges and other legal professionals have no training in these disorders and are therefore not aware of how someone like this can play the role and use the system as a means to terrorize someone seemingly within the boundaries of the family court system. Even with my professional knowledge, I consider myself a victim…a victim highly educated in mental health disorders but a victim no less. My background makes it even more frustrating to stomach this process. A change needs to come and I want to be a part of it by being a voice for single moms and dads who are also being victimized, manipulated and terrorized.
Evelyn, in my case and many other cases I know, the judge intentionally gives full custody to the worst parent knowing that the good one will come back and fight for the kids. This divorce industry intentionally doing this crap to the parents so the everlasting war between parents will have the parents give all their money to the divorce industry leaving the children with no education, no health and no future.
50-50 at least gives an equal start and in your case some escape for your children until you win the rest of custody. Majority of folks are provoked to ugly actions by the unfairness of the corrupt system. All the best!
Fine. That should be for a psychiatrist to comment on, not a judge to decide unilaterally. Do not trained for such things, and I don’t think that’s the type of situation that should be decided just by a judge. Question is should a jury be involved. Of course, we should have a right to a jury of our peers if we are in essence being claimed with being “guilty”
Evelyn, not very many people now about these types of personalities, Not even the judges or lawyers.
When I got married, I totally didn’t know. When I got divorced, I didn’t know.
During the divorced, I finally understood she has Borderline personality.
I couldn’t make up how she could careless about putting the kids best interest first. I know now she has no remorse. She can make the most cruel decisions and think nothing of it.
So guess where making cruel decisions works best. That’s right, in Family Court.
Judges and Lawyers also didn’t understand or know Parental Alienation.
In my most recent court visit (Jan 2014). I had been asking for 2-3 years to attend co-parenting, and try to put some peace on all this. i testified how Toxic was to deal with her. Well, Mr. Judge response was: “Which divorce isn’t toxic”, and through away any co-parenting sessions.
Evelyn, you are entirely correct. Narcissists, BPD, and other sociopaths target empathetic people and their real personality is hidden until it is too late. They manipulate the Courts to punish the partner who is trying to extricate themselves and the kids from the poisonous environment BPD, Spaths narcissists create.
Too often we see this. Confused parents calling their spouses names and giving them diagnoses. It is this kind of stupidity that the whole family court scam is built from,
stupid parents calling each other names (sociopath, narcissist, abuser, blah, blah) in order to pay for the education and upbringing of their lawyers, their custody evaluators, and court personnel trained in conflict escalation.
Agreed, been there my self.
http://www.HowiGotCustody.org
Evelyn, I agree with that in some situations, because people change after the marriage/kids happen too.
But, in 13 years of being an advocate, I’ve seen dads make some REAL DUMB relationship decisions…getting with a woman who previously got kids taken away…she had been suicidal and the guy tries to be her knight in shining armour and she later projects blame on him for all their problems and takes his kids away….a dad was desperate and lonely so hooked up with the slim pickins he had…a lot of poor use of discretion.
Well said Rich…well said!
It’s you’re or your…learn the difference or finish your elementary education. Jeez…
The voting tallies are very interesting and hope that these statistics are being submitted to congress or some other “higher” authorities to see how people are really treated in the court system. Opposing parenting attorneys make up documents, fabricated documents from third parties like HHS without HHS knowing of supervised visitation in my case and yet there are no enforcement of ethics by attorneys.
Yes the statistics are very interesting. Based on our informal polls we intend to construct a statistically significant poll of a broad cross section of Americans and compare the results. If the trends hold up, we will bring it to congress. Thank you.
Absolutely…….would keep the judge AND the people they appoint from being so crooked.
Agreed. The judge should be the referee of the game to make sure it is being played fairly. The referee should not determine the outcome of the game.
Judge? as referee! You’re giving them (they’re lawyers don’t forget) too much credit. No one in the “family court” system has any investment in the children. Only the parents, (and/or grandparents) should be entitled to decision.
totally agree!!!
At this point in time the American Court System is so compromised and lop-sided, I would not have any faith the Legal System would do the right thing that would benefit the children or the parents. Had my children been minors while going through my divorce and knowing what I know today.. I would have lost it…and that’s a fact !
A jury is the better of the evils. Including at couple divorced parents would be yet better. If question of fitness arises from spousal accusations, the accused is entitled to request spouse submit to psych eval (would help in my case) and accuser is penalized on subsequent invalidation of their claim.
Two misconceptions here. A custody dispute should be mediated (not tried). If one parent insists on litigating, rather than mediating or communicating, that parent should be checked into a psych ward and have custody (but not visitation) temporarily taken away from them. In these cases, the court should assign a social worker trained in conflict analysis and conflict resolution, to facilitate communication and problem-solving between the parents.
Magistrates and Judges become too biased and can withhold critical information by adjudicating without clear and convincing evidence. Too many wrong decisions behind closed doors. A jury would keep them honest and hold them to the law.
Janice I agree with you, But. I feel the same way for the minors, who can be hold until their eighteen, who are not allowed a jury since the court feels it is in their best interest. Everyone who stands before the court should have the rights to equal protection.
With the spiritual as well as the mental health condition of so many American’s these day’s, I’m not at all confident that folks on jury’s would do well either. The chances of a jury getting it “right” compared to a corrupted, money-hungry judge however, I believe a jury would be the better choice between the two.
What health condition are you referring to Pastor Paul?
Andrew, If you do very little research, you will find that 1 out of 5 Americans are currently diagnosed with mental health issues. Most professionals and pastors that I speak with, agree with me that the number is actuality 3 out of 5 Americans. That does not even address the many more who suffer spiritual issues as well.
in that case you are a definite sinner every other time you bless ones marriage!
Sarcasm is not helpful, only shows one’s inability to comprehend and deal effectively with truth. Solutions are needed, not put downs Michael.
I agree
This is the job of experts. Specifically, Clinical Forensic Psychologists. They conduct interviews, can administer and interpret psychological tests, and compose competency evaluations for the court.
there is no “expert” that can tell someone they are not fit parents, these are “paid” extortionists…would you like someone to tell do that to you? tell you, you are not fit to raise and be apart of your own child’s life because of their opinion based on frivolous claims and bogus accusations and no real information? I don’t think so…sure, they can submit their “clinical” tests, (whatever that means), but a jury of peers, common people, who have no profit-motive, should bear the ultimate decision, should it even come to that. Because there really shouldn’t be any involvement from ANYONE when it comes to someone’s child, because you wouldn’t want it done to YOU.
As you can see in our movie Divorce Corp, many states allow non-licensed individuals to conduct custody evaluations. Moreover, “hired guns” can be biased in their evaluations. Lastly, psychological evaluations can be very subjective, and influenced by the inherent biases of the individual conducting them. We believe that a jury guards against many of these problems.
I went thru limited case management in Kansas. I thought I would be validated as the good father I had been to my then three year old daughter by the case manager. I thought my ex wife’s vindictiveness would be obvious to this so called professional. I could not believe her 10+ page report omitted almost everything I said in my defense or was positive in proving the good father I had always been. Sad thing is the court accepts these reports as gospel. These sessions are conveniently not recorded and are performed outside the courtroom. Defending yourself from these reports is extremely costly and continues to feed the family law machine, but what other choice do we have if we want to spend time with our children?
A skilled and wise family court judge will require
that “paid” witnesses, whether lay, expert, or court-
appointed, have no role in a domestic relations
trial, or pre-trial, given the inappropriateness and
appearance of impropriety of people being
paid to take sides in a marital dispute (paid
“experts” will typically create disproportionate
distortions in a case due to their perceived
credibility, the cognitive dissonance this
creates, which is why a wise and experienced
judge will not permit this).
At a divorce/child custody trial, should such a thing
occur, the combined common sense and wisdom of
six regular people/jurors, and the presence of the
parents, and any child(ren) who are able to speak,
is all that is needed or should be permitted by the
court. A judge may not take custody or deprive a
parent (or child) of less than 50% custody or
access, but may decide other things in a case,
like support or alimony, with the aid of a court
master who assesses assets, liabilities, and ensures
that legal fees remain equal among the parents, and
less than mediation and counseling fees.
If the case is assigned to a family judge from among
the ranks of senior judges who understand that
mediation is strictly enforced in all domestic relations
cases, taking precedence over all forms of child
custody litigation, then the occurrence of a trial in a
child custody case would be considered a failure in
the performance of judicial duties, as a guardian of the
child, and an embarrassment if more than one or two
child custody cases, in a judicial career, goes to trial.
The judge would also ensure that the two parents
testifying at trial get equal time to present their
testimony and evidence to the jury. If one parent
is represented by counsel, it is the duty of the
judge to ensure the other parent is represented
by an equally skilled advocate, by the date of the
pre-trial conference, or exclude lawyers altogether
if relatively equal representation cannot be obtained.
As the entire custody case is centered on the
best interests of the child, family therapy, marriage
counseling (even if parents are divorced), and rigorous
mediation sessions are scheduled from the outset by
the judge, with weekly mediation sessions.
If a parent is represented by counsel, the resources
each parent spends on litigation fees (war) shall in no
instance exceed what they are spending on mediation
and family therapy. If a judge follows these rules to
a tee, that judge will truly be serving his/her parens
patrie role, as temporary guardian for a child (whose
parents are in litigation, otherwise unavailable/at war).
We need the courts out of PARENTING,,,, Unless there is PROOF WITHOUT A SHADOW OF A DOUBT, then EQUAL CUSTODY SHOULD STAND …..
I am in 200% agreement to this statement!
As am I! Remove the carrot ($$$), remove the problem (judges/attorneys/paid “professional” evaluators), end of story. Let’s let families be families again.
I supposed these experts are to be appointed by the court? Yeah, Right!
And, how much more is that going to costs??? And, who will appoint this Clinical Forensic Psychologists?? I was appointed a Forensic Accountant to go through my books for my business to make sure I wasn’t hiding any money, only to find out I had a very honest CPA, but, that costs me over $14,000, to find out my CPA was doing his job and that I was not hiding money…..Another useless service that costs me one of my kids’ a year’s worth of College…Nice job commissioner
I used a forensic and clinical psychiatrist. He wrote a couple of expensive books used by attorneys, referred to DSM Standards, used treatises and cost quite a small fortune for a full evaluation, The mother used a psychological expert that she got from down the road, couldn’t do a correct examination and was highly unethical . The judge called the forensic psychologists work not credible and dismissed it, the expert was credible and quoted esoteric or never heard of citations and was declared credible. Do not waste time on any experts unless there is a problem, in Jury’s we can trust that there is a chance of fair play, with these courts they must use cookie cutters and a financial analysis to determine the outcome. Always in favor of the state, the former spouse comes second, the kids are just pawns. And you are just fodder. It is what a friend termed not a circuit court but a circus court. .
Unfortunately, these experts are on the payroll and part of the “legal entitlement money grab consortium”. In Sarasota FL, it is common knowledge that Brad B. is appointed by Judges and requested by attorneys. He has lavish dinners and entertains Judges and attorneys in his field. Local attorney’s will attest to the “influence” of his decisions linked to his exorbitant fees (upwards of $3500) for testing. It is a referral business, we don’t refer those who don’t agree with us.
Follow the money… it’s the family law theme. Be sure to keep the blindfold of Justice on so the real crimes aren’t exposed!
You talking about the “experts” (and I use the term very loosely) that prescribe meds that enable adults & children to become so bad, they inflict pain & death on innocent people because of the “experts” decision to place their patients on meds? Have you ever had the privilege of witnessing a Clinical Forensic Psychologist change a patient from med to med? When asked why, they say they are trying to find the right med cocktail…sigh.
I think that both a jury and a regular psychologist is good, preferably Christian in that they are usually pro family. There are many kinds of psychologists, but don’t confuse them with psychiatrists….they refer to psychiatrists who dole out the meds as treatment because a person is not responding to regular therapy. There are good and bad professionals everywhere but there are good and bad jurors. Thing is, you can pick your psych but you never know who you will get for a juror. If you don’t like your psych, try another one, a general psych eval is only like $60. Again, pick Christian psychs and you’ll be better off.
My ex was somehow able to obtain sole custody and my parental rights were terminated all without my knowledge or consent. He was also granted child support and I was never notified or served in any way for anything. I lost my lawyer due to my retainer fee running out because I no longer had the finances to protect my parental rights. He took the children for his visitation and never returned with them. I am now being alienated from my children with no contact. I am a good fit mother as are most targeted parents of Parental Alienation!
Wow, Dotty…I would sue your former attorney for not doing his/her job!!!! Typical incompetent or shall I say “GREEDY….MONEY HUNGRY Dirt bag Attorney????
Dotty-
Never give up the fight! It is always who gets to the courthouse and files their lies and accusations first wins. You will probably just have to go through the motions to prove the charges are false and that your children need both parents in their lives.
I have been exactly where you are and after 9 years I finally have all my non custodial parenting rights back. I was always told that the kids will figure it out on their own what is going on as far as the alienation goes.
You are probably up for an uphill climb, but you can do it!
Roy
Dotty iif you hire a psych who has been trained in parental alienation they will be able to identify it easily by interviewing everyone. But I’d make sure you take the option for seeing a psych to get the eval and make sure you have a good job to show you can support them and be careful who you associate with, as this could count against you. I’ve been through the game to, I got my GAL fired for lying on the stand. Remember, GAL’s are just flunky lawyers who had a bad child hood and need a psych themselves. Hiring one will trump the lawyers/GAL’s as they are NOT ALLOWED to perform evals – only a psych can do this. This is where you can discredit them, as they often fall back on this when they have no actual physical evidence. Watch the new Parental Rights Bill that H.S.L.D.A. is passing through congress.
I think jury would be a lesser of two evils. And perhaps more prine to look at evidence. . Really there are pros and cons to anything. However, its more difficult to pay off an entire jury.
Family court has many challenges indeed!
We need a MALE & FEMALE Judges on a stand in Family court so its Equal….
I have a female judge & its done nothing 4 fairness! She still gave my dd to my alienators (dad&his wife) & continues 2 support their disgusting behavior toward me. And their alienating of my child and I. And she’s not the only one, ive heard from many other alienated parents w.female judges as well. We need 2 take the PROFIT out of Family Court! Thats the root of the issue. Like someone else said: “Follow the money”
Good point Mary. Unlike campaign contributions for judges, the trial outcome for a jury has no effect on their income. Judges are paid off legally every day.
yes, be we must be very careful on that issue even, due to the fact that the judge controls the jury with his orders on what can and can not be factored in…..ive seen other cases where there was no doubt of guilt or innocence that still the jury could not vote their heart and knowledge due to having their hands tied by the judge….so that would be something to factor in to this if we ever got lucky enough for a jury over judge 🙂
I was enlightened by a co parenting professions that works closely with our county family court system that women are the nurturers d men are the providers and it has been that way since cave man times! Yes ….. I was catorigized with cave men and the Judge bought it LOL. Please …. Stop the madness that tears down the American family to make money for attorneys and the judges. Disgusting.
Spot on Ken! I’ve seen this as the common denominator. 96% of cases award mother primary custody (parenting time or other pc terminology to hide the fact) and the house with the logic that the mother is the nurturer and the father the provider. The house is thrown in “as the best interest of the child(ren)” , however, the true beneficiary is the one who gets the check and a free house.
Chris, where do you get your stats? http://www.divorcepeers.com/stats18.htm Please let me know if you have something more current or results of a national study.
Evelyn, every case is fabricated at the court by various steps. Often courts “recommendations” convince father to give up their parenting rights. In Minnesota, there are lobbyists convincing fathers to give up their parenting rights arguing that men are more violent than women. So statistics are doubtful since one never knows how they were conducted and when. I have requested statistics at my court and they did not provide them to me. My children were stolen from me and I am extorted huge child support for them to live in poverty. Court does everything possible to prevent me from bringing facts to them, denying subpoenas, rejecting pictures, testimonies and so on…
There are no real studies as each court keeps monopoly on all information.
yes my rights were taken i had no noledge no laweyer repersied me nothing to stand againt mymomther and ex took my rights which i was given visistation but there the ones who dont follow the order
I do not think it should be a requirement, but there should be a right to a jury. Airing dirty laundry in front of a crowd of people judging you may be too much for some to handle. Every dirty movie watched, every sex toy bought and every stupid decision gets served up on a platter for examination. Personally, I would prefer a jury.Time with my kids is more valuable than my embarrassment.
I was thinking the same (re embarrassing details) but I think you could achieve the same with a judge or jury; 50/50 is the norm unless one parent is unfit. That is the sticking point. I think a way round it is to strictly codify/legislate for what can and cannot be considered unfit. An abusive parent or one who is unable to function as a parent and/or provide as a parent due to being in prison, drugs etc are the only instances I can think of. And this has to be proven. That would stop petty issues from being brought in, baseless accusations and people (judges or juries) applying their own moral codes in such cases.
Providing that a jury must be impaneled before protecting a child from a parent who poses a threat to the physical or emotional well-being of a child is impractical and may subject the child to further harm. For initial custody and parenting time determinations in dissolution actions there should be a rebuttable presumption of Shared Parenting. Findings and Conclusions should be required in all custody decisions.
I believe if a jury were to oversee the parental rights in family courts it would take away a lot of biased judges issuing orders that are unfair & it would cut out of the corruption in family courts also.
Time to take a stance and demand a jury panel for any all family court proceedings. Under our constitutional rights anything that’s worth over $20 we can and should demand a jury panel.
Time to take back our rights & enforce these judges & family courts to be held accountable for their inaccurate biased rulings that destroy families.
My ‘yes’ vote is contingent on a change in the word from ‘jury’ to ‘judge or jury’. I hope that’s what you actually meant.
Appreciate you input, but we meant “jury”. We do not believe that a single human being should be given the authority to make such life shattering decisions. Thanks
Presently the state, with its reserved and generally inscrutable power and decision making, makes decisions on child custody and parental fitness using one or maybe two 15-30 minute hearings and the advice of generally un/underqualified court consultants and private contractors, who themselves are often granted extra-judicial powers while also maintaining blanket immunity from liability.
The absence of transparency and accountability is one of the central themes that has effectively nullified the legitimacy of family courts.
This does not guarantee that a fair trial has occurred. In my case, there were several pretrials over false allegations that neither myself or my ex-wife were a party to. This is absolutely ubsurd! No opportunity to testify and due process and my rights ignored. Even having had my right to testify denied, forced to accept the judge’s custody decision without cross examining my wife or allowing me to testify. At this point, I think it’s time to rebel, but of course you can’t. Because they also have the right to put you in jail if you excersize your right to free speech for standing up for yourself. You can be threatened by a judge of record, they can go on and off record as they seem fit. This system is corrupt and it’s time for a rebellion.
I agree 100% with you Pastor Paul…you go Pastor Paul
There should definitely be some sort of checks and balances when any authority is given in public or government office. I’m not so sure I would be happy about even MORE people having the authority to rule over my life and the life of my children based on their own personal beliefs, however, that is a much better option than allowing my life to be decided by one crazy, outlandishly biased person sitting in a chair pontificating about what I need to do and telling me what I can and cannot do with MY own children. It’s ridiculous to even conceive that we allow this to happen today in 2014, a time of forward movement and so-called “equality” (yeah, right) that someone’s parental rights can be stripped away with one docket number – I walked into court as a father….I walked out as a non-custodial visitor…no due process, no constitutional rights upheld, not even a chance to speak, to defend myself….just constantly berated, attacked and stripped of my children…there honestly should be no court, judge or Jury, if there is abuse or any extreme cases, then that should be handled by a criminal court and that’s that. But custody and child support shouldn’t even be a point of contention or point to debate. Fully shared and equal and complete custody, physical and legal….there is no rationale behind choosing one parent over the other….giving one parent “authority” over the other with their own children is creating a situation of malice unnecessarily….by making it equal, there is nothing to fight over or for, thereby diffusing any possible hostility and reduces the chances of retaliatory and petty tactics. This “profit-for-pain” practice within our government has to stop….its utterly despicable and out of control and its these people who go to court fully expecting to be evil that fuel the incentives. The judges and lawyers know that about these people and simply provide them the opportunity to carry out these deeds, all while turning a profit. It’s great business tho….if I were an arms dealer, how else would I make money? surely can’t have “peace” amongst nations can I? its “conflict manufacturing” which produces a “need” for arms…or in this case….a “need” for legal representation thru the “legal” process. These are sad, sad times America….sad times.
Yes Corey, sad times for us all: families, children, and future generations. Make it stop! Together we can!
It’s a wonder why we had that right taken away from us…The option to have a jury would make the system way more balanced and fair….
I’m hoping that these ideas don’t get buried in the minutia that you are up against…..
After reading all the posts it appears we have a couple of these “experts” leaving comments, perhaps they fear that the days of ripping people off and ripping apart families are coming to an end?
Unless there are extenuating circumstances, emergency needs of the children, or clear signs of abuse whereby the child or children need to be placed in protective custody, the decision to remove a child from a parent SHOULD NOT BE DETERMINED BY A SINGLE JUDGE!
WE NEED MORE OVERSIGHT!
A jury would be wonderful. And I would imagine that most parents would rather subsidize the costs of summoning a jury than continuing to an ongoing battle.
50/50 parent time sharing for the kids of divorce should be the standard solution to custody of children, unless there is compelling information for a different solution. Divorce should not weaken the children’s bonds with one parent and prefer one parent over the other. The normal divorce requires one parent have more time with the children than the other. This is typically linked to child support payments to the parent with time with the children. This is a strong motivator for expensive, time consuming and child damageing custody battle which enrich the attornerys, damage the children emotionally and improverish the children financially. Parents should be treated equally in this country.
Life is simple. Why do they make it complicated? Equal shared parenting. That’s it.
We need a jury to put a stop to the unfair decisions made by some crazy judges.
I wish it were this easy. For equal legal custody, this makes sense. However, the complexities of physical custody arrangements can’t cater to 50/50. Decoupling money and custody is a good start but only part of a sound solution. Please see: ae5050.com for my detailed thoughts.
I wish it were this easy. For equal legal custody, this makes sense. However, the complexities of physical custody arrangements can’t cater to 50/50. Decoupling money and custody is a good start but only part of a sound solution. Please see ae5050.com for my detailed thoughts.
Patrick: “Complexities of physical custody arrangements cant cater to 50/50?” What do you mean? The time period can be two weeks or a month to each willing parent if that is what is needed to ensure stability and continuity for the kids. If a parent can put a kid through hell because he/she needs to get his/her itch scratched elsewhere, that parent must be made to deal with the so called complexity engendered in joint physical custody which accords the kid a scenario as near as the kid would have had had the parents kept the family intact. The child needs and requires both parents. The primacy of such a premise trumps the premise that the parents right to divorce is front and center and everything else about the family must be reconfigured around that right. I bet the divorce system will be happy to defend and uphold the parents right to do anything that will make them a buck including the parents right to compromise the wellbeing of the kids by subjecting them to the corrosive, corrupt, and self-serving machinations of the divorce industry practitioners. The parent that is ready to compromise the kids welfare by breaking up the family should be the one doing the heavy lifting when it comes to child custody arrangements. Perhaps it will discourage some couples from having kids. So be it. The ones that do will be the ones who are capable and willing to shoulder the responsibilities of a family with children. Yes by all means let us throw the Ronald Reagan innovation of “no-fault’ divorce out into the toilet and bring back the “fault” divorce at least as it pertains to custody arrangements.
Prabhakar:
It would have been more accurate for me to state: Complexities of physical custody arrangements can’t ALWAYS cater to 50/50.
I have the same passion for punishing the parent causing the turmoil. The problem within the courts is the impossible task of determining who that is. So impossible, in fact, we need to avoid allowing the courts to try. The person who has more money or cries the loudest wins these battles. 50/50 is a safe goal. However, it is only a goal. Many divorces end up with the majority of custody going to one parent allowing more continuity for the kids – in their best interest. The complex challenge is simple laws that can both keep narcisstic people in their place while allowing flexibility for parents that are on the same page.
We need real reform and I think the important question is how deeply we want the government involved in our personal decision to divorce. Unnecessary bankrupcies and children driven away from loving parents is a sign that the government has too much say. I agree what people are doing is wrong. I believe having the government decide is not the solution.
The U.S. Constitution REQUIRES a jury trial for anything over $20!
This is ALL our assets, our children and a large percentage of future income for child “support”.
Lawyers will tell you they are “exempt due to calling it an “Equity Court”,. BULLSHIT!
Under The Law of Supremacy NO STATE MAY MAKE A LAW THAT OVERRIDES A CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT! PERIOD!
They are all, literally, traitors to their oath to the constitution.
The CLAIM that the “Domestic Relations Exception gives state the right to do whatever they want.
Again a LIE to save money and give them power that ALL 50 states totally ignore.
All family court judges re acting as CRIMINALS when they limit or terminate parental rights without:
1) A jury trail
2) Clear and convincing evidence of unfitness
3) Based on gender to mother – s this is a violation of the 14th Amendment.
Bob:
Youve hit the nail on the constitutional head. The “Domestic Relations Exception” should be litigated for constitutional integrity. SImply stated, this exception is the rule that allows judges and their family court minions and the divorce system mercenaries to mint money over the anguish and lifelong distress caused to the children involved. It is amazing that the American populace willl be more than willing to raise a ruckus to fund a foot ball stadium so a team can remain in town but will show total apathy and ignorance when it comes to the forcible and ugly dismantling of the fundamental right of a child to each of its parents care. You make a good case but how about posting the entire text in a different forum – one that is concerned about the welfare of pets say. Tweak the”Domestic Relations Exception” to read “Domestic pets Relations Exception” and “child” to “pet” keep the rest the same.
Now watch the firestorm that erupts with folks falling over themselves to “right a major wrong” , the money raised, the ads run, the congressmen collared, the lawsuits filed etc etc even . It is a downright shame.
First and foremost, more people need to realize they do NOT have to go through the family court system for ANYTHING when they want to decide what to do with their kids. Many people already do this; we need to spread the word.
Second, if we think a jury would benefit these decisions, shouldn’t juries also be used in place of CPS yanking kids out of their home because of false or trumped up allegations? Why stop at divorce/custody trials?
Finally, here’s what I would do… Require both parents to sign up for Our Family Wizard when they start divorce proceedings. EVERYTHING that happens from day 1 until their case is finished is entered there. If Mom has a complaint about Dad, she puts it in there, where he can respond, and vice versa. Any issues that might come up are all RIGHT there in black and white. If someone is withholding the kids, it’s there. If someone isn’t picking the kids up on his/her time, it’s right there. If either party wants sole custody, any evidence they might have would be documented, and answered by the other party. (You can also pick up on psychotic behavior, some of you know what I’m talking about…) When it comes time to make a decision on both parents (assuming both are wanting sole or joint custody) ALL REFERENCES TO GENDER ARE REMOVED FROM OUR FAMILY WIZARD. “HE” OR “SHE” IS REPLACED WITH “A” OR “B”. Whether it’s read by a judge or jury or 6 people trained to make these decisions, they have no clue who is the mother or father, but if one of them is clearly off his/her rocker, they can make a decision on the facts. There should be guidelines set in place that help this process, such as PAS behavior is a mark against you. Drug/alcohol problems are a mark against you. An empty fridge is a mark against you. And most importantly, if you are the “innocent” getting blamed for stuff, your defense is right there in writing… Accusation: “Kid said fridge was empty in the morning and there was no milk for cereal.” Response: “We went out for breakfast and visited family for potluck lunch, where we got enough leftovers for 3 days.” Accusation: “B was 30 mins late for pick up, so I took the kids with me to run errands.” Response: “I got a flat tire on the way to pick up, and notified A 10 minutes before I was due for pick up. A took the kids so that I couldn’t get them.” Hope this makes sense. It sure does to me.
Interesting idea.
The courts feed on any system that prolongs a divorce. Here are a couple:
EVIDENCE
A never ending documentation of every step a parent makes is information overload and ultimately useless in determining anything. I am privy to a four-year divorce case where a family card game with the word “kill” in the title is evidence that a mom is a threat. That’s insane. We need a system that has less information, not more. The government doesn’t need to know if I have milk in the fridge.
CO-PARENTING CYCLE
The courts back co-parenting. Here is what really happens in reality. You spend years ratifying a custody agreement with someone who is unwilling to negotiate. When you finally have the document in hand protecting your rights, the other parent decides co-parenting is the way to go; nullifying everything the court decided. The judges are two faced. “Why didn’t you follow the agreement?” “Why aren’t you co-parenting?” It perpetuates paychecks.
Ourfamilywizard.com has some limited usefulness. My ex recently tried to move my custody around. I just quoted her the court order and she moved it back. It is also a way for manipulating people to get their way. Use it with caution and personal boundaries.
Patrick, I agree with you to an extent, but the fact is that only a fraction of parents end up in long drawn out court battles over the kids, and it’s over stupid things like no milk in the fridge! They sit before mediators, case managers, attorneys, judges, etc. paying for everything along the way, and before it’s over, nobody gets anywhere. Put it in writing; it saves time and shows patterns that might or might not be important. If you didn’t put it in writing, it didn’t happen. And more importantly, BOTH parties are “heard” not just the crazy one. I’ll give you an example of a simple contempt charge that took TWO years. High conflict couple finally gets things finalized, but Mom finds a way to (in her mind) deny overnight visitation (Dad fell asleep next to daughter, comforting her because she was scared about the new environment). He thought he was going to force her to follow the papers in court, but it turned into NUMEROUS complaints in her response, which now opened everything back up for scrutiny. More court, case managers, “he said she said,” gigantic mess. And her accusations were unfounded and untrue. Happens all the time. This chick was batshit crazy. They were instructed to communicate ONLY via text or email so things could be documented. If OFW was being utilized, it would have taken ONE glance at the complaints and responses to end the whole tirade and tell the idiot, “Follow the papers, or custody will be reversed.” In the end, this guy repped himself in court and won on the majority of his complaints.
Regarding co-parenting, high conflict parents (which tend to be the same ones who fight over the children) do not “co-parent” in the end. They “parallel parent.” Using OFW is useful for that as well. And no, I don’t work for them LOL
No one should lose custody of their child without grounds. Any decision not based on fault or ability is bias.
Divorce COULD be handled like turning in your license plates at the MVA. But UNAMERICAN FASCISTS have turned our lives upside down so they could PLUNDER US!!
END the PUBLIC PRIVATE PARTNERSHIP of CRIMINAL RACKETEERING!!
Below is a link to some FREE info to learn more:
http://www.pinterest.com/pin/473511348292848857/
I am currently looking for volunteers to transcribe and source each video for use in building a class action case. Please find me on FB if you are interested in FIGHTING UNAMERICAN FASCISM and CHILD ABUSE for PROFIT RACKETEERING.
Best to All Good People,
Ted
Ted Palmer
Forensic C.P.A. (Ret.)
Physically Disabled Father & MD Father Court Victim
First at least a 6 person Jury of a stable history is needed in family court. Children want and need in some ways both parents and extended relatives. In the best interest of every child -one single bias judge does not know nor care enough to know what the children need or want muchless follow the laws. What is in the better interest of children- Not having their families and lives torn to shreds. It is always best to try harder to stay away from family court or all will be lost sometimes forever. Children placed in risky situations cost lives muchless tons of unjustified burnt up stacks dollar bills. Children should come first when it comes to safety, health, well-being and protection. I vote for children first!!!! Facts- history does show ones parenting troubles which places their own children at risk.
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Bless and keep them safe to all your loved ones,
In my opinion if a child had a TRUE voice that would/could make a better difference in family court and in their lives as a whole!
I have a female judge & its done nothing 4 fairness! She still gave my dd to my alienators (dad&his wife) & continues 2 support their disgusting behavior toward me. And their alienating of my child and I. And she’s not the only one, ive heard from many other alienated parents w.female judges as well. We need 2 take the PROFIT out of Family Court! Thats the root of the issue. Like someone else said: “Follow the money”
Ur so wrong when u say its only a small percentage. If u actually knew the high amt of families stuck in the family court system¬ over stupid things! Most high conflict cases are bcos the high conflict parent is mentally unstable, suffering from a personality disorder. Such as narcissitic personailty disorder, borderline personality disorder, etc. And these ppl will&do stop at nothing, using their kids as weapons, 2 hurt the other stable parent by doing everything they can to alientae them from their lives permanently. Google Parental Alienation, read some of our stories this is an epidemic the world over! And it requires a revolution 2 save our children!
Parents don’t have to be unfit in order for shared parenting to be impractical. It is good to start with a presumption but it must be rebuttable based on best interest factors such as distance, schedules, resources, etc.. — factors that don’t necessarily question a parent’s fitness.
Try getting divorced in Oregon. Oregon is one of the few states where it is against the law for Judges to award joint legal custody. Unless the two agree on joint custody, it almost always goes to the woman. Now I’m stuck paying for 90% of my son’s upbringing without any say on how he is raised.
I am sorry. Most of the comments in this exchange here miss the point. Child time should be 50/50 with each parent, as the standard assignment. Exceptions should only be for clear exceptions of demonstrated unfitness of the parent and in case of conflict, a jury might decide the fitness of the parents. However, fitness of the parent should not be determined by baking cookies, knowing the teachers’ names and such social efforts. Fitness of the parent should be judged by social skills, friendships, morality, education, employment/earning power, willingness to devote time to the children, stability and ability to provide a good home for the children. Sex organs have nothing to do with parenting. Sex organs are only important in conception and child bearing. Mothers and fathers each have their own gifts to share with the children. Women and men have the same potential for earning income, based upon their willingness to do various jobs and their willingness to get educated. Previous generations were less able to do this, as women only learned housewifery skills, weakening their earning power in the jobs market. Many of the ills in the child possession issue in the family law structures are encouraged by the law’s tendency to assign unequal child time for the parents and the strange notion that the lifestyle of the custodial parent and children should be maintained after divorce, often at the expense of the non-custodial parent. Unequal child time forced on the parents by the family law system should be considered illegal in this country.
Jury required.
-If the case involves a potential international parental abduction, the state must provide an expert on the Hague Convention of the 1980.
-No judge or jury can’t decide to allow a minor (born in the United States) to travel outside the United States or it’s territories, not even for visitation. It is the parent’s decision, not the state.
Let’s protect our American children from being “legally deported” to foreign lands leaving the American parent without resources to bring him/her back.
We have juries in Texas child custody but they the judge will allow the abuser to eliminate evidence including past violent criminal history that can be used against the abuser. If the whole system is broken and corrupt which it definetely is in Texas will have to tear it down and start over.
Family courts are an exceptionally formed type of tribunal, for reasons best left to what people have tolerated rather than what the judiciary promised when the original divorce laws were reformed to no fault divorce. They promised that common law courts did not alleviate the trauma and distress children were subject to and a new type of court was needed. That was almost five decades ago, and today if anything we have not only a worse situation for children but an entire industry built around catering for the aftermath. So really what type of courts are we dealing with, they are certainly not courts of equity that is for sure. I believe these courts are not only places where evil people assemble and think nothing of the human consequences of their actions they are in fact a very special organization with powers that even Hitler did not directly have.
Although I do not think a jury should decide whether or not a parent is fit, I do not think one sole person (a Judge) should have the power to make this type of decision. I think there should be a “panel” of some sort, made up of judges, psychologists, attorneys, etc. that should all be involved when making such a decision that has such a huge impact on the lives of families and children.
I agree with Kim about having a panel. But excluded from
the panel should be:
1. family lawyers because they often lie and deceive to
create parental conflict (i.e., they harm children for a living);
2. psychologists (who have no relevant expertise
to make custody decisions, especially if they are
paid by parties, lawyers or courts to do so); and
3. judges (judges, in the US, are simply lawyers and they are not
trained to be judges per se; in most modern countries, judges
are in a different profession, the judicial profession, requiring skills
and training that are quite different from those of lawyer/advocates,
in the legal profession).
The panel should be staffed by:
1. men and women of varying ages,
2. social workers,
3. Non-lawyer mediators.
I discovered what I believe are the roots of this entire federal enterprise, If means that you must look at the US as an entire corporation and we are the consumers who are in a privileged state subject to the whims of revenue and long term goals. At the end of World war II Brock Chisolm was reputed to have stated that the most important thing that needs to happen to western cultures is that, Men in particular should be removed from their sense of individualism, religiosity or sense of family. Females generally are the best form of social catalyst, simple because they are more inclined to fall for socialized indoctrination. While the philosophy may and I say this loosely have some form of higher goal. It is essentially the post world war management of populations using federal models that are not any different from previously tried methods. With wording and technology we just revise the wording and the pathway or social vectors to make simple consumer market shock tests.
Search yourselves for a document authored By Rebecca J. Cook, ‘Formulating population policies for the US. from 1974, From that point if you believe in the veracity of purpose and the document itself, Do research from the federal reserve another sourcing document based on the evolving Corporate welfare theorem is called WP630, and outlines the methodology in very obscure techno and math speak, but is still understandable.
Mercantilism based on the newer credit type system is an evolving too big to fail system, and like many other pathways where the federal reserves investments and coercive strategies have a long term outlook under the doctrine too big to fail, the courts are the same. Too big to fail at whatever cost even if it is morally and truly repugnant to all that encounter it and what they believe in.
The current practices of family law are an exact replication of USSR family law code from the 1900’s onward and the results will be exactly the same, with the same type of output and resulting demographic changes.
Post industrialized man and his thinking has also to be removed from history, what better mechanism to change history than the supplanting if it with a revisionist feminist federally endorsed and subsidized version, it is working. ? Men had nothing to do with making the world today, they have not contributed one good thing to the development of culture, they do not need to be influencing children and generally should not be near females. Believe it breath it and you will be a convert.
As for history, how many people know that mercantilism makes no distinction between the value of humans other than productivity, females today are the best modeled consumers, Sure there is a cultural bias as a grouping yet , the federal reserve determines that certain classes have 100% efficiency in this particular economy. After all lets look at mercantilism in the raw, not less than 120 years ago black slaves were too expensive. Fetching 100 guineas on the block. So what did our elite resolve to do when Britain changed its economic policies in this direction. Well our artful masters chose to ship white women to the Caribbean and have them reproduce the best slave workers to produce the Mulatto who like any cattle breeding program for productivity, cheaper yes, Eastern European women and the indentured Irish female only cost 3 – 5 guineas on the auction block, but lets get some highly prized bulls to increase the productivity value of insemination programs. That will not be in the feminist historical lessons. As for males always disposable for whatever the cultural direction takes them.